Other than Barks, which Disney comic artist do you like best

Santiago Ceballos, William Van Horn, Paul Murry, Don Rosa, etc.

Postby Egg » Tue Apr 18, 2006 3:54 pm

Duckman-site wrote:In King Scrooge the first (1967) where Barks only did the story and plot (it was drawn by Tony Strobl), Scrooge is said to be a descendant of an ancient king (King Scrooge-Shah of Sagbad) who lived in Sagbad (a Barks-gag based on the name Bagdad) somewhere in the Middle East around 2000 years BC.

I think it's a classic story. Is it true that Daan Jippes has made a new version of this one? Is it true Barks's sketches finally have surfaced.

Don Rosa wrote:['King Scrooge the First'] Well, I thought the story was a bit lame and signaled that the man was a bit weary of writing. And I would have had trouble linking $crooge's family, which might have come to Scotland from Norman France and to Norman France from Norway, to relatives in the extremely distant Mid-East, and didn't like the idea of trying -- those are not nationalities that I would want in these Duck's ancestry. Anyway, it was my decision to include that among the various Barksian facts that I choose to dismiss and/or ignore, such as the Magic Hourglass and so forth.

Rosa, the underground adult collector who even can't use Donalds Bolivar, because his sister didn't buy a comic with Bolivar in the early 1950s. Or what was the reason? It was on the Rosa Network (DCML), last year.
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Postby Egg » Tue Apr 18, 2006 4:05 pm

Don Rosa wrote:I thought the story was a bit lame and signaled that the man was a bit weary of writing.

How weary of writing is Rosa?

Don Rosa wrote:And I would have had trouble linking $crooge's family, which might have come to Scotland from Norman France and to Norman France from Norway, to relatives in the extremely distant Mid-East, and didn't like the idea of trying

King Rosa just didn't like the idea of trying.

Don Rosa wrote:-- those are not nationalities that I would want in these Duck's ancestry.

Read carefully. Rosa says "I would want". Fanboy Rosa puts himself above genius Barks.

Don Rosa wrote:Anyway, it was my decision to include that among the various Barksian facts that I choose to dismiss and/or ignore, such as the Magic Hourglass and so forth.

Rosa explains how he made up his world. Rosa does whatever he likes. The only way is Rosa's way. That's what I read in this comment. Someone who ignores Barks this way, should be forbidden to even to try a "life-story" of Scrooge'. Especially if it just seems to work towards to a dead Scrooge. Rosa wants the Barks duck to die.
For Rosa Scrooge is dead already at the time when Barks was still working. Rosa scraps Barks's work from 1966 to 1999. That's more than 30 years of Barks career. Scrapped.
I'd say it's better to just scrap Rosa then.
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Postby Egg's uncle » Tue Apr 18, 2006 4:19 pm

Please children. Have a heart. Do not mention the R-word when my little nephew Egg is around.
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Postby Doctor Witchie Britchie » Tue Apr 18, 2006 5:53 pm

"How can such a disdain on fantasy creatures survive with Disney comics? What do editors say of it? Don't they have a responsibility to keep Disney comics on the track?"

You bring up another problem with Rosa right there, Egg--he always insists that he's not doing Disney comics, he's doing Barks Duck comics. He's made his contempt for all non-Duck Disney characters--from Mickey Mouse to Dumbo--very clear over the years, which has perhaps led in part to the lack of interest shown in Mickey and other classic non-Duck Disney characters here in the United States, which contains so many Rosa-followers. "Don Rosa thinks Mickey Mouse is a dumb children's character--therefore Rosa fans should not read Mickey Mouse comics." Rosa has also ridiculed "middle-aged women" who "claim to like comics but then say something like 'Chip and Dale are so cute." Rosa is not grounded in the Disney tradition, and I question how well someone who has such contempt for all other branches of the Disney family can understand the Ducks. Not very well, judging by the bulk of Rosa's work.

I also agree that the ridiculous controversy surrounding the classic Magic Hourglass is entirely Rosa's doing. When the story was reprinted recently in this country, Gemstone felt obliged to put a framing sequence around the story--making it a campfire yarn told by Louie--in order to avoid the angry reactions of Rosa fans who call Hourglass an "imaginary story." Simply ludicrous! Many other of Barks' stories--including one of Carl's personal favorites, Island in the Sky--have been given the status of "imaginary" stories because they violate the timeline set up by Rosa.

Incidentally, it's easy to connect the Scotch Highlander McDucks to the Persian King Scrooge-Shah, despite what Rosa says in the remarks quoted by Egg above. There is evidence that the Gaelic Highlanders originally hailed from Miletus, on the Turkish penninsula (the Irish Gaels, ancestors of the Scotch Gaels, have always been known as Milesians). The Persian rulers of Bagdad (or Sagbad) live in the middle east, not far from Turkey. The Persians, like the ancient Milesians, were Indo-European peoples. What is more likely than that King Scrooge-Shah and his kin fled Sagbad after the sack by the Mongolduks and sought refuge with fellow Indo-Europeans in Miletus. After several generations, the royal Sagbadian line became blended with the Milesian nobility, and descendants of Scrooge-Shah sailed to Ireland with Eber and Eremon, the leaders of the great Milesian invasion. Later, the McDucks, a clan partly descended from Scrooge-Shah, crossed over to Scotland with many other Milesian families, and thus became a powerful Highland clan. Simple, eh? Are these the lines the Italians followed in the stories Egg mentioned?

I recall Rosa's claim that he couldn't use Bolivar in a story since he wasn't allowed to introduce him as a new character and since he would NEVER pretend Bolivar had been a member of the Duck household all along--another preposterious statement. If Barks had been totally unwilling to introduce characters and pretend that they had existed all the time, he would never have created Gyro, Gladstone, Scrooge, the Beagle Boys, and I don't know how many others. Rosa has been called imaginative, but in this as in other matters he shows a deplorable lack of imagination.
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Postby Rockerduck » Tue Apr 18, 2006 5:59 pm

Egg wrote:Egg is VERY disappointed in Robb_K and Rockerduck, for being negative on Al Hubbard.

Well, I'm very disappointed that you like him so much, so I think now we're even. By the way, everybody is entitled to his or her own opinion, right? :)

Egg wrote:Al Hubbard's style looks like the xeroxography(?) of Disney animation movies of the time. Pencils were transferred directly into "ink", which gave the animators a lot of creative freedom. This style is used in 'Sword in the stone' up to 'The Rescuers', from early 1960s up to the 1970s. 'Robin Hood', one of my favorites is among them.

That's an interesting comparison, but not a compliment to Hubbard's drawings. The Disney animation films that were made in that style look not too good when compared to other Classics.

Compare Lady and the Tramp to Sworde in the stone, for example. The drawings in Lady are fluent and round, the animation and characters look 'complete', they're very life-like, you feel like you could touch them. The drawings in Sword are rough, like they're sketches, the characters look like the animators rushed through it. Lady is coloured perfectly, with all kinds of shades and shadwos, very life-like. Sword is coloured like a tv-animation series: it looks cheap. Not to mention that Sword in the Stone was a major flop, the public didn't like it and the critics thought it was awful. Same goes with Robin Hood, which was considered as old-fahioned, in a time when all the other Hollywood studio's were creating a new style in film-making. That's why Disney inthe 1970's and 1980's almost got no profit from their films.

So all in all, their are better ways to try to compliment Hubbard's work.

Egg wrote:I think Fethry Duck works best in Al Hubbard's xerography-like style. No one can make such a great Fethry as Al Hubbard.

So, in short: Shame on you. Fethry-haters!

I like Fethry very much, but not when drawn by Hubbard. The Italians are doing a fine job in drawing him, and do the people at Egmont -which we Dutchmen never get to see in our magazines, by the way!
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Postby Rockerduck » Tue Apr 18, 2006 6:13 pm

Robb_K wrote:I also can't stand Rosa's Duck drawings (although I like his scribbles. I'd rather see comic book stories printed with his unfinished scribbles. His inking stiffens his figures greatly. But, in addition, I don't like his layouts and perspectives and crowded panels and dark and heavy shading. Might as well have Robert Crumb drawing The Ducks. Also, his "sequel" stories seem very forced andunnatural to me. To me, his best stories are his short gag-run stories. But, I'm sure I'll make a lot of enemies on this forum because of my taste regarding Rosa.

Oh no, everybody's entitled to their own opinions! After all, this is not DCML. ;)

I liked Don Rosa's drawings afew years back. Not his very early drawings, from stories like 'The son of the sun'. Although I didn't think they were *that* bad, I felt like Rosa was trying too hard to imitate Barks and that just didn't work out. Rosa soon found his own style in drawing, which I liked very much. I've always been a sucker for his crowded panels and detailed backgrounds. It was a new style in Disney comics and therefore, I found it refreshing. His characters were drawn very well in the mid-1990's, I think, especially in the story 'The last Lord of Eldorado'. Besides, his 'Picsou'-pin-ups show he can really draw well. His artwork has declined dramatically, however, in the last two years. Especially the heads of his Ducks and their facial expressions keep getting worse with every story. Too bad, 'cause he used to be pretty good at it.

Now, his stories, I've always liked. With that, I mean his way of story-telling (aside from the drawings). I don't know about you, but I surely felt that 'The son of the sun' felt like a Barks-story (and for you cynical ones: that's not meant as an insult to Barks!), with a lot of excitement and fun in it. It was his 'Life of Scrooge'-series that really got me, though. I had not nearly half as much Barks comicbooks as I do now, when the series was first published in The Netherlands, so it was impossible for me to get all the references to Barks-stories, but that didn't matter. I was around the age of 9 when I first read it, and I treated it as an original story. I didn't knew the name of Rosa until he was named in a Dutch comic book from 1996, and I didn't use the Internet until as early as 1998 I think, so it's not like I was influenced by Rosa's self-promotional 'bragging' on the Net, as Egg likes to call it. I discoverd Rosa on my own and liked him. His last stories weren't all that good. I'm looking forward to the next Caballeros-story to be published, but I'm afraid of the 'Prisoner of White Agony Creek'.

Egg wrote:But these opinions are only expressing my taste, not implying these artists aren't good artists (although I think most of the Disney artist were better at drawing than Rosa).

I agree with you on that. As much as I like Rosa's drawings from a certain period of his work, I like most Disney artists better for their drawings. But when it comes to story-telling, Rosa wins over almost all of them.
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Postby Rockerduck » Tue Apr 18, 2006 6:19 pm

By the way, if Egg wants to turn this thread in a 'Rosa-bashing' thread AGAIN, I'm not gonna join in. I thought this forum was a new chance to discuss Disney comics, but it seems to me that it's only here for Egg's obsession with the 'errors' Rosa made. I mean: look at all those posts he made dedicated to Rosa-bashing! It's onsessive! Start a new thread if you get a rise of it, but don't spoil this topic that was started with an other purpose.
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Postby Egg » Tue Apr 18, 2006 6:30 pm

Rockerduck wrote:By the way, if Egg wants to turn this thread in a 'Rosa-bashing' thread AGAIN, I'm not gonna join in. I thought this forum was a new chance to discuss Disney comics, but it seems to me that it's only here for Egg's obsession with the 'errors' Rosa made. I mean: look at all those posts he made dedicated to Rosa-bashing! It's onsessive! Start a new thread if you get a rise of it, but don't spoil this topic that was started with an other purpose.

Hey! What about all the Barks-bashing in the media, Rockerduck? Why don't you complain about that? If you don't want to revive the old days on the Dutch section 'Rosa and Barks', I don't see why you're mentioning them. :rolleyes:
If you just want to have a new thread, just say so or make one yourself. ;)
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Postby Sharkie » Tue Apr 18, 2006 6:46 pm

Doctor Witchie Britchie wrote:I also agree that the ridiculous controversy surrounding the classic Magic Hourglass is entirely Rosa's doing. When the story was reprinted recently in this country, Gemstone felt obliged to put a framing sequence around the story--making it a campfire yarn told by Louie--in order to avoid the angry reactions of Rosa fans who call Hourglass an "imaginary story." Simply ludicrous! Many other of Barks' stories--including one of Carl's personal favorites, Island in the Sky--have been given the status of "imaginary" stories because they violate the timeline set up by Rosa.

Don Rosa wrote:Fri Apr 14 09:36:25 CEST 2006

For my own amusement, I try to put exact years on any "Life of
$crooge" story I create. Because, to me, these are events of a specific and
definite "past". I think I look upon the line between that which is set in
stone as being a year or so after $crooge meets Donald & HD&L in late
1947... therefore, take the year 1950 as a nice even year-date. My stories
set in the "present" are taking place *sometime* after 1950. But each
exactly when? No, I envision them as happening in a very general "present",
in a swirl of early-mid 1950's, sort of all at the same time in an abstract
manner like Olaf said. I try to never contradict myself (or my view of
Barks' stories) when dealing with those "Lo$" tales. But if you try to
determine in what order my "present" stories take place, you might be
confounded, because I never worry if I'm putting trophies in the background
of one story that couldn't really be there yet if another story took place
first or later or whatever.

Uh?
so Barks stories are made in a time line and have a definite past but his own stories are just random placed. How contradictionary. Rosa finishes of Barks work but it is too much work to continue the time line.
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Postby Egg » Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:02 pm

I've made a new topic for Disney comics in general. To avoid this topic-subject turning into liking comic artists least. :)

*EDIT* boardlinking updated to McDrake
Last edited by Egg on Sat Feb 10, 2007 1:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Rockerduck » Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:05 pm

Egg wrote:Hey! What about all the Barks-bashing in the media, Rockerduck? Why don't you complain about that? If you don't want to revive the old days on the Dutch section 'Rosa and Barks', I don't see why you're mentioning them. :rolleyes:
If you just want to have a new thread, just say so or make one yourself. ;)

Barks-bashing in the media? Which Barks-bashing? I don't have the slightest idea what you're talking about. Are you making this up on your own?

I don't want to revive the blackening and ganging up on just one artist. You just started that with post after post about how bad and evil Rosa is with phrases like 'King Rosa this and King Rosa that'. That was and is not what this thread is intended for. And guess what? I openend this thread!
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Postby Egg » Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:19 pm

Rockerduck wrote:Barks-bashing in the media? Which Barks-bashing? I don't have the slightest idea what you're talking about. Are you making this up on your own?

Don't you read the articles and messages about stories of Barks being bad, having bad days, making lame stories, etc.? You can't mean you've forgotten that. There's a lot of (too) hard criticism on Barks.

Rockerduck wrote:I don't want to revive the blackening and ganging up on just one artist.

Who does?

Rockerduck wrote:You just started that with post after post about how bad and evil Rosa is with phrases like 'King Rosa this and King Rosa that'. That was and is not what this thread is intended for.

Come on, have a big laugh when talking about our idols, to a certain extent. That's helps to relativate matters. (Also up to a certain extent, of course.)
I English I have difficulties in writing imaginative creative language anyway.

Rockerduck wrote:And guess what? I openend this thread!

Really?!? Was it you? May I have your autograph then? :D
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Postby Doctor Witchie Britchie » Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:32 pm

Actually, old Doctor Witchie Britchie is really the one responsible for taking this thread off-topic into Rosa-bashing--you have my apologies. Though I do think Rosa has had too much praise and I like to air my many criticisms of him from time to time, this thread wasn't really the place to do it. Sorry about that.
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Postby Egg » Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:35 pm

Doctor Witchie Britchie wrote:Actually, old Doctor Witchie Britchie is really the one responsible for taking this thread off-topic into Rosa-bashing--you have my apologies. Though I do think Rosa has had too much praise and I like to air my many criticisms of him from time to time, this thread wasn't really the place to do it. Sorry about that.

Doctor Witchie Britchie is too soft on Rockerduck.
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Postby Egg » Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:36 pm

Doctor Itchie Bitsie afraid of Rockerduck.
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