Don Rosa's Life And Times Of Scrooge

Santiago Ceballos, William Van Horn, Paul Murry, Don Rosa, etc.

Postby Egg » Sat Oct 28, 2006 3:17 pm

Egg wrote:For example, Barks's work is famous in The Netherlands. Barks himself, on the contrary, is almost anonymous. (Despite being credited in the album series.)

And remember that Barks work includes creations like Scrooge McDuck, Gladstone Gander, Gyro Gearloose and Duckburg.
Ask a Dutch person who created the famous Duckburg, and most of them would only refer to the Disney company. In fact, most of them wouldn't even care to answer such a trivial question.

Artists and fans share the interest that they want each other to be important. The artist wants a huge fanbase, and the fanbase wants a huge artist.

Only few people would take the time to write about someone they dislike. And even if they do, just a few fans could already make so much fuzz about it, that the critic gets demonized.
On webpages, Rosa fans have recommended to complain to newspapers that were negative about Rosa, with links included.

Remember Wacko Jacko? (Alias Michael Jackson.) An artist could even sleep with other people's kids.
Many Jackson-fans have kids. Could they refuse the love and "sincerity" of their idol? How much would it need to get the shells off their blinded eyes? Does dear Michael want to sleep with our minor kid? Well, why not? "We know we can trust him."
Michael Jackson is famous, unlike whatever Disney creator. Most of these people find Jackson a fool. Would they tell him that in the face? Jackson could claim that "everyone" believes in him, because people don't care to tell him when they think otherwise.
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Postby Egg » Sat Oct 28, 2006 8:28 pm

Robb_K wrote:['The Prisoner of White Agony Creek'] Unfortunately, I doubt that his mistake in that story will disenchant even one of his ardent fans.

As you can see here in this topic, some Rosa fans do protest against the story, in multiple levels.

At first people didn't believe that Rosa would ever break his promise about leaving that month up to the reader, and now Rosa not only has crossed that border of leaving Scrooge and Goldie alone, Rosa even included suggestive adult language. How to get attention for dummies.
After Scrooge's family got either killed or depressed in Rosa Life of $crooge, it's now time for another underground shocker to divide the fandom. The "mistake" looks like a willfull attempt for yet another controversy about which the author can claim that he didn't intend it that way, and that he was just pleasing himself. The latter sounding a bit like a wordplay now, concerning Rosa's fantasies about his $crooge and his Goldie alone together in a remote Yukon cabin during winter.

- - - - - - - - - - - -

Don Rosa on DCML, 7 November 1996, about Scrooge en Goldie:
I know you're a newcomer to the Group, and welcome. But have you considered reading through the archived Digests to see what's already been discussed here? It should take you only 6 months or so to read those 10,000 pages. (!) Anyway, I've always said that I would NEVER do a story where I show $crooge and Goldie having any direct contact in the Yukon days. I purposely built "Hearts of the Yukon" around a situation where they NEVER interact. Barks did the only such story that there should ever be, and for anyone to ever deal with their brief time together in the Klondike would be to dilute the significance of that meeting. The only contact they had was that month alone together at White Agony Creek, and we use our individual imaginations as to what took place in that time. No, sorry, I'll never do the scenes that you say you wished I'd included in the "Lo$".

- - - - - - - - - - - -

Don Rosa, date unknown:
"C’mon, now! You’re a big boy, right?! $crooge and Goldie alone together in a remote Yukon cabin during a long, cold and snowy winter? What do you think would happen?"
http://www.don-mcduck.de

- - - - - - - - - - - -

Robb_K wrote:['The Prisoner of White Agony Creek'] He draws The Disney Ducks as Robert Crumb would. Now he decided to write his Duck stories as Robert Crumb would. Isn't that ironic?

Crumb is unknown to me. An example of Robert Crumb art, according to Google:
Image
I can't read the French(?) text, but the art looks remarkably like Rosa's to me.

Wikipedia has a page about Robert Crumb: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Crumb

Robb_K wrote:It would be funny, except for the fact that I resent Egmont's staff for allowing it in print, and for my jealousy regarding his status versus that of peons like me.

Would it be funny at all? It's so cheap. Like an old uncle destroying a children's party with dirty jokes.

Maybe it's just me, but I remember 'Hearts of the Yukon' having at least a little romantic taste. Looking at the samples of 'Prisoner' it seems to me as if Rosa has lost his touch. In writing and art.
Which, in Rosa's case, is a disaster within a disaster. In 'Hearts of the Yukon', Rosa sets The Blackjack Ballroom on fire. A place that is "later"(!) used in Barks's 'Back to the Klondike'. What was the excuse? That the place was rebuilt? Wasn't the wooden place really so much afire, that no one could have rescued it? Even worse, Rosa lets the fireman use frozen hoses to safe the place. Look how fast the city changes from a bonfire to a swimming pool. It must have been raining firemen that day. And still people will claim it to be authentic and in line with Barks. (They're mixing up both artists anyway.)

How come Rosa got to write the Life of Scrooge at all? AFAIK it was on request of Egmont, who searched for an artist willing to build up a Scrooge history. Does someone know?
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Postby Egg » Sat Oct 28, 2006 9:00 pm

Cynical text ahead.

Here are some tricks Eggs sees in making a succesful tribute to a legendary artist:
- Call the tribute a personal document that you only make for yourself. In love for the original artist, of course. (Ignore the contradiction.)
- Only use a small portion from the artist's classic years, to keep your research easy. Most people won't see the difference anyway, as they only know the classic years. Suggest your work is part of those classic years, so that later years can be ignored at will.
- If you forget something, you can make a sequel to patch the error. Of course, the sequel will also have errors, but then you can make yet another sequel or you find an excuse.
- Give people something else to do than concentrating on your stories. Put some puzzles in it, make the background so detailed that people don't know where to look at. That makes them feel small.
- Suggest (or just claim) that you know things the original artist didn't know, thanks to your devotion and many hours (brag brag) of research.
- Take an internet account and regularly spend some time on internet to keep your fanbase warm. It will be at cost of the quality of your work, but a warm fanbase won't mind that. They will love you for your efforts. And so they take care of the free publicity, telling the world how good it is to have you as idol.
- If someone calls you an idol, tell them that you're just a normal guy and tell them some windy stories about how also you are amazed about the (brag brag) huge fabulous success and the mania around you.
- Treat every complaint as if it's the first complaint you ever got.
- Admit your work is inferior to the original artist, but... (and then fill some capacities that will make still you look very special, even if it's at cost of the artist). The fact that your inferior work is being enjoyed by (let's say) billions and billions of readers, only proves how good you would have been if you'd better your life.
- Tell complainers how much you do your best to keep everything accurate. When there's a little error, tell the complainer that he/she is the hero who found just that one little error you missed after (brag brag) hours of spending time at the library. That will make the complainer blush in admiration, thinking they're almost as smart as you. Watch out for stubborn complaints, especially the ones about huge errors in your work. Turn them down by saying you are just having fun for yourself, that most people like to see how you please yourself, and that the complainers are the ones who have a problem.
- Retire early. You'll be a living legend asked to have a come-back, which will be an event in itself. A promotion within a promotion. ("Mr. Legend is back! Write an article, put his name on the cover!")
- Sell your possessions as celebrity items, as if you're as interesting as your idol. This will make your stuff worth more for collectors who'll think they can invest in your name rather than in what you sell them.
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Postby Egg » Sat Oct 28, 2006 9:04 pm

Here are some other samples of 'The Prisoner of White Agony Creek':
Image

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Image

Image
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Postby Egg » Sat Nov 04, 2006 9:03 pm

2006-05-14, Doctor Witchie Britchie wrote:These "Prisoner of White Agony Creek" pages seem to me to show once again how much Rosa has utterly deteriorated. All his humor derives from pain, cussing, and ill-nature, or (in the case of Donald's saying the kids are "too young" to know what happened between Scrooge and Goldie during their time on White Agony Creek) thinly-disguised "wink wink" double-entendres.

I also notice that he's continuing his debunking of several beloved historical figures (as he did with King Arthur, Buffalo Bill, and Wyatt Earp in earlier stories). I assume that's supposed to be Earp who's conked with the rock at the top of the third page; I wonder who the other two "American legends" are that get kayoed and thoroughly "shown up" by Rosa's super-nasty-Scrooge. Incidentally, the always-historically-accurate Rosa has drawn poor Earp as far too young; the man was in his fifties when he journeyed to the Klondike. He made the same mistake when he included Earp in "King of the Klondike."

source: http://bb.mcdrake.nl/engdisney/viewtopi ... d=701#p701

What do you mean with debunking of several beloved historical figures? What happened with King Arthur, Buffalo Bill, and Wyatt Earp in earlier stories? I expected that at least the real-life history would be correct.
Didn't Rosa tell on DCML that King Arthur was historically accurate, in contrary to the image of King Arthur being some polished king?

According to Wikipedia, Wyatt Berry Stapp Earp lived from March 19, 1848 to January 13, 1929. He was a Teamster, sometime buffalo hunter, officer of the law, gambler, and saloon-keeper in the Wild West and the U.S. mining frontier from California to Alaska.

Image
Wyatt Earp at about age 39, photo in San Diego about 1887.

more information: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wyatt_Earp

*EDIT* boardlinking updated to McDrake
Last edited by Egg on Sat Feb 10, 2007 2:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Doctor Witchie Britchie » Sun Nov 05, 2006 1:22 am

Rosa depicted Wyatt Earp as an egotistical, bumbling idiot in his KING OF THE KLONDIKE story, which is certainly not the way the man was in real life. He's still controversial in this country, some (such as myself) claiming he was a hero, others a cold-blooded killer, but no one has ever accused him of being a clown or a bufoon, as Rosa depicts him.

As for King Arthur--certainly, the real Arthur wasn't the polished medieval knight of romance, but Rosa went out of his way to make him barbaric, ignorant, and incompetent. The historical Arthur, insofar as anyone can learn anything about him, was a British (Welsh) chieftain who sucessfully (for a little while, anyway) defended Britain against Saxon invaders after the Romans pulled out of the country. Arthur's deeds were magnified in legend and song by suceeding generations of Welsh, and when the Normans invaded Britain they picked up the stories, transferred the characters to the current age (the medieval age) and created the most familiar version of Arthur. But the real Arthur was clearly a beloved and valiant leader, and possibly (so some have theorized) had been educated by the Romans, so Rosa's characterization is totally wrong. I'm part Welsh myself, though, so perhaps I'm partisan.
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Postby Robb_K » Sun Nov 05, 2006 1:56 am

King Arthur (Artoris) was, supposedly a composite of several Brythonic tribal leaders (petty kings) from Wessex, Devon, Cornwall and eastern Wales, all of whom fought the Germanic invaders (" So called-Saxons"). I've read that the name Arthur was derived from was supposed to mean "King" in the ancient Brythonic. As DWB mentioned, it is very likely that such a leader had been educated with the Roman elite in Britain if he had grown up before 440 or so. The Romans OFFICIALLY left Britain in 410 AD. But, it took a while for their systems to degrade.

I assume no one really has a valid complaint against Don Rosa for being "historically incorrect", as The Ducks don't live in our "real World". Their universe includes Duckburg, Calisota, and a lot of places not in ours, as well as beings that look much unlike any we have in our World. Technically, he can do anything he wants in his stories, and not cast any doubts as to their historical correctness.

Despite that fact, I suppose it would be better if he portrayed such characters as we DID and DO have in our real World as accurately as possible. Why else would he use them? Personally, I would use as few real-World historical characters as possible in my stories, including Scrooge's and Duckburg's history. But, he shouldn't cast mud upon those people, as they have descendents still about, who may be offended.

I also doubt that Wyatt Earp could have been a bumbling idiot, and still have survived as a peace officer and gun toter in the American "Old West".

As a Duck and Mouse comics reader and fan, I always liked changed-name parodies of well-known human characters much better than having my Duck heroes meeting actual humans from our own history.
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Postby Doctor Witchie Britchie » Sun Nov 05, 2006 2:13 am

Robb_K wrote:As a Duck and Mouse comics reader and fan, I always liked changed-name parodies of well-known human characters much better than having my Duck heroes meeting actual humans from our own history.

I agree, Robb--I can't think of any other Disney creator that brings real people on the scene in the way Rosa does. Barks referred to historical figures like Marco Polo, King Solomon, and Genghis Khan, but never utilized them as actual characters. The changed-name parodies allow the quasi-historical characters to be as goofy, heroic, stupid, or phony as the writer needs, without throwing needless dirt on what used to be folk heroes.
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Postby Flintheart Glomgold » Sun Nov 05, 2006 1:01 pm

A few weeks ago, Don Rosa visited Germany for one of his big comic book signing tours.

From what I heard (mostly through web forums), the thing he did most was complaining. Complaining about how the translation of his comics was that bad (For example, he disliked, that the German title of 'Return To Xanadu' gave away , that Xanadu equals Tralla La (Here is what he did with one fan's comic book). Or that in 'Hearts of the Yukon' those historical charakteres both got fantasy names (Samuel Benfield Steele being Oberst Bodo von Beinhardt; William Scarth being Hauptmann Segebald Strammauf), etc.), complaining about not beeing paid extra royalties for gettting his name printed on those 'Hall of Fame'-books (Maybe he would prefer his name not being mentioned at all, like in the good old days, where all the comic books where 'drawn and scripted by Walt Disney himself'?).

His success has grown about his head, if you ask me!
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Postby Egg » Sun Nov 05, 2006 3:10 pm

Flintheart Glomgold wrote:From what I heard (mostly through web forums), the thing he did most was complaining. Complaining about how the translation of his comics was that bad (For example, he disliked, that the German title of 'Return To Xanadu' gave away , that Xanadu equals Tralla La (Here is what he did with one fan's comic book).

You must be kidding. The title in panel 1.1. is crossed out, and with the same marker in panel 1.5 the Taler(?)-sign has been turned to a dollar-sign. And this done with a blue, thick permanent marker. Did the owner ask for that?

Image

Years ago Don Rosa has "corrected" articles by Geoffrey Blum, in a book that compiled Rosa's Lo$-stories. Rosa complained on DCML that there were errors that had to be corrected, and if I'm not mistaken, he accused Geoffrey Blum of willful frauding. The corrections in the book were manually done by Rosa, with stamps.
About fan-drawings at conventions, Rosa has said on DCML that he wants to put stamps on each fan-drawing, so that fans can't sell it. This was a few years ago.
I'd have to check sources on this all. Often I read writings by/about Rosa that I can't believe. How is it possible that Rosa can go so far, without anyone correcting him? Rosa behaves like a moth burning himself in the sun.

Rosa has also complained about Barks's behaviour, at a time when Rosa expected to get in close contact with Barks. Some of Rosa's friends and fans change history by putting the blame on Barks's managers, but any DCML-reader can see how much Rosa himself was involved, raising up fires and gossips against Barks. It's a miracle that Barks still invited Rosa, years later. Even more because Rosa himself would never forgive his own enemies, in case someone would do the same to him as he did to Barks.

Rosa is overprotected by "friends", fans and editors. It's amazing to see Rosa getting crazy in the media. Rosa seems to expect that people are coming just for him as person, instead of his work. No matter what he does. Meanwhile his stories, the stuff that he should be known for, have imploded both in writing and art.
And I guess that no one dares to tell Don Rosa the truth, because he would then damn each complainer to be a persona non grata.
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Postby Egg » Sun Nov 05, 2006 3:18 pm

Flintheart Glomgold wrote:[Rosa] complaining about not beeing paid extra royalties for gettting his name printed on those 'Hall of Fame'-books (Maybe he would prefer his name not being mentioned at all, like in the good old days, where all the comic books where 'drawn and scripted by Walt Disney himself'?).

Didn't Rosa get extra payment from Egmont, after his strike of a few years ago? I've heard that the matter was about being payed for the use Rosa's name. I remember a DCML-posting from someone at Egmont who told that Rosa gets an above average payment.

Rosa himself has supported crediting in comic books. And now he gets credited, he wants to be paid for it.
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Postby Egg » Sun Nov 05, 2006 3:26 pm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2006 11:14:30 -0400
From: "Don Rosa"
Subject: RE: DCML Digest, Vol 44, Issue 15
To: dcml

From: Mark Small
>>>>> when I come across news of Don Rosa, he is on tour, or visiting some
comic conference. I don't think he has time to think about new stories while
he is being feted upon like this.
...Can anyone (even Mr Rosa) enlighten me?

Gosh, that's the way my life has been for about the last 15 years, not just
lately! Does it leave me time to do ANYTHING? Not much! Consider that when
any other author or cartoonist gets this popular (for whatever weird reason)
& busy... and other Americans in this situation who spring to mind and with
whom I'm often at European conventions would be Neil Gaiman and Jeff
Smith... they hire an assistant(s) to take care of most things for them. But
that's not an option to me working in this system. I still answer 100% of
my own mail everyday, personally see about all that's needed from me by
Egmont or Gemstone or any other publisher, do all my own organizing & travel
planning with convention sponsors, publishers, etc., deal with my own
lawyers, as well as try to keep up with my *normal* life as much as I should
in continuing with my comics, books, music, movie collections, and running
my own household which includes maintaining a 25 acre (10 hectare) estate
like a national park with trails and meadows. How can their be time for all
that?! There *hasn't been* for 15 years, but I always put the Ducks first.
Lately circumstances have caused me to place everything on a more even keel,
so I am taking care of my own life a bit better than I have in the past two
decades... not being an iota less busy, but just channeling the work % in
different directions... I'm still missing far too much of all the things I
always expected to do in life which I see I'm not getting done as the years
roll past. Plus my wife is retired (schoolteacher) now and would VERY much
like me to simply start selling my comics collections and retire with her so
we can both enjoy ourselves, travel, etc., rather than me locking myself to
the drawing board so earnestly for 3-4 months nonstop on each project. I
sold just a fraction of my comic collection last year, just the "new" stuff,
1970-1985 stuff, and (with the help of friends) I made more $ in 6 months
than I made in 6-7 *years* of doing Duck comics. So you can imagine how I'm
torn between what to do next. There's no pension waiting for anyone who
spends their life making comics, but I have a pension waiting my use in my
collections of "stuff". Just waiting. But I love making $crooge stories!
But.... but...
But I'm still working on the two projects that Egmont tells me are most
urgent at the moment -- I am completing my contributions to the 4th ROSA
HALL OF FAME book for one Egmont division, while for another division I am
creating a series of 12 posters for the 60th anniversary of Carl Barks'
$crooge McDuck in 2007. And yesterday a big mucky-muck in another Egmont
division called me about another special project being considered for next
Spring. When I get those projects done, then I can see about a new
story......


------------------------------
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Postby Flintheart Glomgold » Sun Nov 05, 2006 3:43 pm

Egg wrote:and with the same marker in panel 1.5 the Taler(?)-sign has been turned to a dollar-sign.

In Germany, the initials of Dagobert Duck (Scrooge McDuck) are written on his moneybin ('DD'), rather than the currency sign of the Taler. In the same way, 'MacM' is written on the moneybin of Mac Moneysac (Flintheart Glomgold), 'KK' on the office building of Klaas Klever (Rockerduck) etc.
But what does Don Rosa know about German translation tradition? He himself suggested on DCML once, that in the German Carl Barks Collection they should use a new translation nearer to Barks.
I guess, the german Donaldists, who also adore the work of Dr. Erika Fuchs, haven't heard that quote, when they gave Don Rosa honorary membership two weeks ago.

Egg wrote:And this done with a blue, thick permanent marker. Did the owner ask for that?

I don't think so. But most diehard fans worship even the ground on which he stood. If Don Rosa uses their personal comic book for complaining, you think they might even get unconscious of happiness.
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Postby Iron Doll » Sun Nov 05, 2006 4:01 pm

Flintheart Glomgold wrote:I guess, the german Donaldists, who also adore the work of Dr. Erika Fuchs, haven't heard that quote, when they gave Don Rosa honorary membership two weeks ago.

Image
Iron Doll
 

Postby Flintheart Glomgold » Sun Nov 05, 2006 4:07 pm

It seems, as if he want's to blackmail Egmont. In a german message board one visitor mentioned, while visiting him at one of the comic book signings he asked him, what he wants to do next.

Don Rosa replied underhand (I translate analogously):

Maybe nothing, if the annoyances by Egmont regarding the 'Hall of Fame'-books don't stop. He is angry, because they printed his name on the front page and odds and ends wheren't done his way, e.g. they have used an other cover than he wished for, used bad colouring, bad translation, etc.

If those matters don't stop and they disfigure those books with his name on front, he'll quit, sell his collection of comic books and earn his money with something else. There would be other ways of earning money, he says.
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