COA/Inducks

places related to Disney comics, etc.

Postby Daniel73 » Tue Aug 15, 2006 5:18 pm

Rockerduck wrote:You know a lot about Barks and Rosa and that's why it's interesting to have you on a message board. You also stay in contact with several Dutch Disney artists, which is also valuable. But what use has that if you're constantly fighting and solving personal matters that don't belong here?

Most of what I say on-topic gets ignored. As is now the case again.

Harry writes badly about my person as a matter on itself, and so I found it necessary to give at least a response. I'd rather skip the subject. I've (again) written some COA/Inducks-suggestions which Harry enthousiastically liked by phone, but on internet he ignores them. It shows how much he's really interested. Well, okay then.

As might be getting clear people won't need to worry about much more contributions by me. Last week something shocking happened, the case Sander G., which I see as an apotheose of my bad experiences with secretive people, and I don't want to be part of that world anymore.
In public some people behave different than in private messages, loading people up with secrets and disturbing matters, and I want to get back to just enjoying my hobbies and meeting real-life friends.

There's so much more to do than sitting behind a computer, faithfully explaining myself to people who stay anonymous themselves. (Even though they've said that anonymity is bad.)
I'm an open and honest person and so I get disturbed by all these people hiding themselves behind their careers, hobbies, supposed expertise and clubs. So I think it's clear why I don't fit in this place. I should have kept distance from internet and fandom.
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Postby H.H.F. » Tue Aug 15, 2006 5:54 pm

Daniel73 wrote:
Rockerduck wrote:You know a lot about Barks and Rosa and that's why it's interesting to have you on a message board. You also stay in contact with several Dutch Disney artists, which is also valuable. But what use has that if you're constantly fighting and solving personal matters that don't belong here?

Most of what I say on-topic gets ignored. As is now the case again.

Saying things on-topic is the purpose of forums. Now, when you start to bad mouth other people like you do, you are bound to get negative feedback. If you think trolling is the only way to get noticed, you approach fandom differently from most people. They are not here to get recognization or stir things up.

I don't think that it was Harry (or Rosa for that matter) who started to treat you like dirt in public. You need to hone your people skills a great deal if you want any kind of credit from fellow fans. Treating others like crap will just get you the same treatment. Now you just look like a bully who wants desperately recognition. If you disagree with something, there is no need to get overly personal about it.

Taking a break might be a good idea. Puts things in right perspective.
H.H.F.
 

Postby Rockerduck » Tue Aug 15, 2006 5:58 pm

Daniel73 wrote:Harry writes badly about my person as a matter on itself, and so I found it necessary to give at least a response. I'd rather skip the subject. I've (again) written some COA/Inducks-suggestions which Harry enthousiastically liked by phone, but on internet he ignores them. It shows how much he's really interested. Well, okay then.

Harry has explained there are numerous reasons why your suggestions and ideas cannot all (immediately) be realized. The problem is, as Harry says, you never listen to those replies, but instead to what you want to hear. You wánt COA/Inducks to be a scary, secretive club, because that's already in your head (God knows why). If you'd listen to Harry, you would hear many more reasons why your ideas aren't all realised.
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Postby Harry » Tue Aug 15, 2006 7:22 pm

I wrote:You'll probably read a lot more of nonsense like this on this forum.

And I was right! :)
Harry
 

Postby Harry » Tue Aug 15, 2006 7:26 pm

Daniel73 wrote:So, Harry should tell if he wants to continue helping with my project DVEGEN.

As long as you keep behaving like this, the answer is "no, of course not".
I can't imagine why you still think the answer would be "yes".
Harry
 

Postby Harry » Tue Aug 15, 2006 7:31 pm

This is so ridiculous that I have to react:

Daniel73 wrote:in a comic book shop, as he did 16 years ago when meeting me when I was 16. I found Harry's behaviour so remarkable and intrusive that I first tried to just get rid of him, despite his knowlegde on Barks. But Harry insisted we should exchange addresses and I was too perplexed to just say no.

And after that, we had a paper and e-mail correspondence for more than a decade.
And frequent visits to each other.
And all that after I behaved so intrusively, while Daniël never told me anything about it.

Who believes that, believes just anything.
Harry
 

Postby Daniel73 » Tue Aug 15, 2006 7:37 pm

H.H.F. wrote:I don't think that it was Harry (or Rosa for that matter) who started to treat you like dirt in public. You need to hone your people skills a great deal if you want any kind of credit from fellow fans. Treating others like crap will just get you the same treatment. Now you just look like a bully who wants desperately recognition. If you disagree with something, there is no need to get overly personal about it.

I don't want recognition. I've discussed my hobbies and people found it necessary to discuss me. Mistake is that I took it personal and that I got slowly into personal secretive matters about what certain artists do or don't, what fans do or don't, what fans know about artists, what artists know about fans, etc.
Subscribing to some secretive "private" élite club catalyzes my complaints. My reason for raising a public COA/Inducks topic here is to be away from personal matters.

Rockerduck wrote:Harry has explained there are numerous reasons why your suggestions and ideas cannot all (immediately) be realized. The problem is, as Harry says, you never listen to those replies, but instead to what you want to hear. You wánt COA/Inducks to be a scary, secretive club, because that's already in your head (God knows why). If you'd listen to Harry, you would hear many more reasons why your ideas aren't all realised.

I do listen to Harry's replies but he seems to expect me to agree while I don't. Even if I would blindly follow his directions, I still don't understand most directions. COA/Inducks has got some facilities that only have made it more difficult to communicate for people who do have ideas but no clue about how to get these ideas through. COA/Inducks is alienating the average user. And it's the average user I'm mostly interested in.
If you think COA/Inducks is a nice place, try it yourself. Get lots of private contact with fans, authors, editors, etc. Let's see how you'll handle the secretiveness and bureaucracy. Let's see if you still find concentration to even read a comic.
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Postby Daniel73 » Tue Aug 15, 2006 8:35 pm

Harry wrote:This is so ridiculous that I have to react:

Daniel73 wrote:in a comic book shop, as he did 16 years ago when meeting me when I was 16. I found Harry's behaviour so remarkable and intrusive that I first tried to just get rid of him, despite his knowlegde on Barks. But Harry insisted we should exchange addresses and I was too perplexed to just say no.

And after that, we had a paper and e-mail correspondence for more than a decade.
And frequent visits to each other.
And all that after I behaved so intrusively, while Daniël never told me anything about it.

Who believes that, believes just anything.

I've told you many times that I see you as an older person, and that this makes it difficult to comment to you. I would have saved myself a lot of energy if my personality would have been stronger all the time, instead of loading myself up and then complain.
There have been many times when I've wanted to say something. But mostly we have one-way discussions in which you act as being a "neutral person", putting yourself into the center as some judge. I've often complaint about how you put through your words, but then shut down the contact when I reply.

I've repeatedly told you how ridiculous I find some of your comments and actions, but you don't listen. As if you are still the adult. I've also seen that in other communication, on DCML, where you alienated newbies because of their grammar. You were angry about them. As if you needed a reason to be angry about. And then I explained you that the kids were mostly getting to learn English, after which you relaxed a bit. Temporarily. But it felt like talking to a father to please not be upset.

Once I've tried commenting to Harry the same way as he did. And then he got very angry about me being intrusive in his internet behaviour. That's what I mean with one-way communication. As if only adult Harry can tell right from wrong, telling Daniel the kind of criticism that he doesn't accept about himself. This entire discussion shows how big the distance still is.

I've tried to do something in return, for example by making DVEGEN more fun for Harry by suggesting to connect my input to COA/Inducks, so that I could index for COA/Inducks in DVEGEN. But this function gets ignored, except for a one-way communication to what already is indexed in COA/Inducks.
My indexing even has a reversal effect. Thanks to me Harry found some Barks Disney work that he'd rather erase from COA/Inducks. (Cover preliminaries.) As this gives my help a reversal effect, destroying parts of COA/Inducks, I can get pretty nervous communicating with Harry. Even if it were a joke. (Which it wasn't.)

What I index for COA/Inducks gets filtered by Harry. And I can't get past Harry because he's the writer of the software I'm indexing with. No wonder people complain about me doing nothing. I could fill a museum with Barks Disney art that keeps on being excluded from COA/Inducks. Why? Only Harry knows.
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Postby Daniel73 » Tue Aug 15, 2006 8:52 pm

Harry wrote:[project DVEGEN] As long as you keep behaving like this, the answer is "no, of course not".
I can't imagine why you still think the answer would be "yes".

Well, one reason could be that maybe you like software yourself. If I would have known that you have certain conditions, and that it was just out of some friendship, I would never have started with it.
If you don't want to work on DVEGEN, I'll have to find a way out myself. Maybe I'll just put the input online and leave the project. If my power depends on keeping someone satisfied, in this case Harry, then I don't have any power at all. Then I'm just a slave begging for someone else's time.

DVEGEN turns out to be another example of one-way communication between Harry and me. For me, DVEGEN never was intended to be a personal matter. I thought it was useful and gave a lot of new insights, also for COA/Inducks. But if you were in it for friendship or charity then we're wasting each other's time.
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Postby Daniel73 » Tue Aug 15, 2006 11:55 pm

Recently I've grown out of being a collector. I'm only preserving my collection for information that other people might want, if they're interested. In recent years, I've experienced how relative human life can be and I just want to go back where I was, without these possessions. No matter who I loose. Collecting has distracted me from what life really is about. In private I've been ranting how important it is to me to get rid of materialism. Which wasn't quite understood as I was talking to collectors. The apotheose of last week is just the final drop. I don't want to join such a world anymore. Just to quote a Barks story by memory: If you can fix it, you can have it.

It's time I give attention to friends who are friends because they are my friends, even if I insist I'm not worth their attention at all. I've had enough of the attention. People in real-life are worried about me getting into this virtual indexing "private" collecting etc. stuff, and warned me that I'm worth much more than joining such matters. I have talents of my own which get terribly wasted by pleasing other people. I've always wanted to be an independent person, and now finally I am.
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Postby Rockerduck » Wed Aug 16, 2006 12:09 am

And yet another thread about Disney-Duck-related stuff has turned into thread about Daniel...
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Postby Daniel73 » Wed Aug 16, 2006 12:20 am

Rockerduck wrote:And yet another thread about Disney-Duck-related stuff has turned into thread about Daniel...

For your convience I can repeat my long on-topic contributions of page 2, about indexing for example Barks and Jippes, including some insight in how some of their stories were made:
http://bb.mcdrake.nl/engdisney/viewtopic.php?p=1286#p1286
http://bb.mcdrake.nl/engdisney/viewtopic.php?p=1291#p1291
http://bb.mcdrake.nl/engdisney/viewtopic.php?p=1292#p1292
http://bb.mcdrake.nl/engdisney/viewtopic.php?p=1293#p1293
And Ramapith's answer:
http://bb.mcdrake.nl/engdisney/viewtopic.php?p=1302#p1302

*EDIT* boardlinking updated to McDrake
Last edited by Daniel73 on Sat Feb 10, 2007 3:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Rockerduck » Wed Aug 16, 2006 12:23 am

That doesn't make up for all this blabbering about Harry and your personal feelings about him. You should've dealt with that in private.
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Postby Daniel73 » Wed Aug 16, 2006 12:35 am

Rockerduck wrote:That doesn't make up for all this blabbering about Harry and your personal feelings about him. You should've dealt with that in private.

Most of my blabbering is about COA/Inducks, DVEGEN and working (failing) on those projects.
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Postby Rockerduck » Wed Aug 16, 2006 12:38 am

...

Sigh...

You know, just like everybody else, I'm tired of quarreling with you.

Seek yourself another sparring mate.
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